Radek Sali

Yes, sure. So, yeah, and thank you for your kind words and I've been following your journey with admiration. So, thank you for your trailblazing. Bit of bro love. Um, the the Yeah. So Swisse Swisse was a journey that that started for me back in 2007.

Um so okay you know no sorry 2005 that's when I got married 2007 um that's why it's another important date but 2005 so and it was a just over 10 years uh by the time I finished the journey when I joined Swisse it was uh about a $13 million turnover business. Okay.

Um it had about 30 people working in the organization. Uh by the time I'd finished it was turning about 700 odd million dollars, still growing at 50 odd percent.

Um and had over a thousand people and was the number one natural healthcare brand in China. Um it was a wild ride um that that we kind of decided 5 years before we sold it that it was probably a good time to sell. I wasn't convinced it was a great time to sell until the final two years of that process. Um and and yeah, so it was it was a business that grew 50% year on year.

uh for 10 years consistently. When I started, we started in the category um it was a category that was only growing at 1 to 2 3%. I had a lot of luck because the trends of health kind of came along with me. Good winds of change as people started to think about their health a little bit more. Um but but we we we definitely were in a position where we made the most of that luck and and created a whole lot of momentum that was you know that grew the category you know beyond 20% by the time we we were we were finished with it. Um and and its secret source wasn't really the the the premium product which it was yeah and the external uh things like the premium product and and the fact we would retain 70% of our customers when they took it.

Um, but then the marketing of it, telling people the story and the high-profile marketing campaigns that we

It's close. Okay, there you go.

I think there was a lot of following intuition but repeating an intuition of you know what what felt right but also once we followed that intuition it was making sure that we focused on what had made us successful and then got bigger and more audacious in what we would do to uh as the pattern or the repeat the kind of the the the cycle we'd call it the 360° wheel. Um and and so we turn this wheel and and it have a whole lot of dynamics of selling, marketing, pushing pull strategy, the talent and wow factor that would then open up other doors. So Nicole Kidman was our our individual that opened up international markets for us and we always felt we needed to think internationally. We were called Swisse and we're an Australian business. Um and so we needed to think beyond just being an Australian focused business. Um and so yeah so we one up and so part of this one-upsmanship was part of this culture that we created which was our secret source and culture cannot be copied outside of organizations. So we were we were doing with what 7% of our revenue our payroll was spent um you know Blackmores who did exactly the same thing was spending 21%. and and they had a great culture and we had equally recognized culture in the end we we won best employer three or four times over and 20 years 10 years later not 20 um the company still wins best employer after we've sold the business so you can see culture sticks and stays and it and the business is now a billion dollar turnover business so even these days

well I wasn't really a founder I was a reimaginer and so I came in when the business was a little bit bigger 10 13 mil um and and I had business partners who had great values but they'd got to a point where they had grown it as far as they could and they needed someone who came from Village Road Show which is a big multinational. Thankfully the entrepreneurs for that business were based in Melbourne and are based in Melbourne and so I learned so much about big vision and change but also then worked learned about systemizing that and and enabling people to make decisions without the founder being in the room. Um so yeah I reimagined that business, grew that business um have now founded or reimagined seven different businesses exited three four um and um you know delivered over a 1,000% return each time. So we've gone pretty well but plenty of failure along the way too

First tranche was uh 2015 at 1.67 six seven uh billion and then the second tranche which I still had 30% of my shares and I also had a unique little trick in the um in the contract they had that they could sue me for 100 million US if I left before a 15 16 month period um I was counting down the days that's why I say 15 16 um because it was 16 um but yeah and we had an earnout that was three years but uh it became quite challenging to kind of work with you know across two different countries and and you know different interests and and and different cultures to to inter intertwine. And as I said, I was done. Like I I was not the guy to be on the plane three three weeks of every month anymore. I was very happy to stay on, but without that threat, I would have stayed on very comfortably, but the threat was there. Um and so yeah, we we we got the the last tranche out for 2.1 billion. So

we we were growing that rapidly. It was ridiculous. So it went from like 120 20 million EBITDA to to close to 300 million EBITDA over the following 12 months. So yeah.

Yeah. And that's the that's the best time to sell is when the winds are with you. Yeah. That's when things are kind of looking the other way. That's a challenging time to get a result. And that's why it took 5 years because we were, you know, navigating some difficult times. You know, there was times when we were turning $300 million in revenue but had zero profit. So and $70 million worth of debt. So they were pretty challenging.

Yeah, I think uh no I didn't want to sell because I knew we wouldn't get the billion dollar value that I always felt in my gut that intuition that we talked to that we were always you know was it going to be a fair price for our organization and the work we'd all put in. Um, so, so yeah, I wanted to sell at the right price and at that profit point where you had work to do. And we're in turnaround mode, but um, and that takes a long time to kind of for everyone to understand that you're you're you're going to deliver what you're saying you're going to deliver. U, we had to convince banks and and shareholders that that was going to be the case to the point where we did get offered $100 million for the business after the debt we'd had um, at 9 months before we sold uh, the business.

No. Well, my business partners did, but I didn't because I had $15 million worth of debt and only 15% of the business. So, you literally just break even. Yeah. Well, I think after our debt, it was 30 million. So, sorry, it was 100 million and 30 million after the debt. So, I would have been bankrupt. Um, so I had to convince them one more time that my insanity was a good idea to follow and we we will get maximum value. Thankfully, um, yeah, sanity prevailed and we got through.

Yes. So I'd been traveling the world like it we we we always do and continue to do for inspiration and um and so we'd been going to China. We'd been going to to Europe, um US and and just taking in Asia as well. are taking in trends and and what we could see as a trend in China is that supplements were quite expensive there and they weren't of high quality. Um and so we we felt that there was a great opportunity there but you you needed a local partner and I'd actually been to China uh in when I was looking to other things to kind of break the cycle of working at Village. I looked at looking at Gelato ice cream stores in Guangzhou, which is actually the the city of the place that ended up where the company that was based that ended up buying our business. So there it was pretty um unusual to be back there again um talking vitamins. And so yeah, my one of our eventual business partners, he was an executive and and real professional international export and and developing international business. He had connections with his company and helped them start up as a business. And so he connected us with the company that eventually bought us and and at that time which pitched the business for them to buy in and and they would have bought a percentage of China, the China business, half of the China business and all of that money that we were trying to raise 50 mil. Um we would have put straight back into the the China market and shared the the value and they were very interested in doing that, but it was probably a year of relationship building, but that that fell over. Um and they just said they weren't ready. They had some other distractions in the business. So we we just kept the relationship going. Um and and so we went to the US and and the US called for us. They loved what we're doing. They'd seen our growth and and so we went for the US and but what we didn't move away from is thinking global. So we always went with global assets like Nicole Kidman. We're on the Ellen DeGeneres show. We we brought the whole audience.

Well, no I wasn't. I was in the audience that all got invited back to Australia to and we filmed a season of Ellen in Australia.

Um, which was genius because before she got vilified and taken off TV.

Yeah. So, so um yeah, so we we we launched the US alongside that. It didn't work. The product wasn't on the shelf. Retailers didn't deliver what they were going to say they they were going to. All of a sudden, we're in a massive dead hole. My my um my my grocerers were were charging me extraordinary amounts to be on their shelves. But I'd prove the point that we would be number one if we're given the same shelf space as Blackmores and and and so Chemist Warehouse and the likes of the rest of pharmacy started to give us the same space and and margin was a little friendlier on that side. Um and so so yeah, we we also were spending 50 million on on on marketing.

And so I always knew that we could pull back on that 50 mil and that would go straight to the bottom line.

Yeah. Everyone. And so we're kind of the original influencers. So I go

Correct. Yeah. She was so sassy and and on it. She still is. Um and and so yeah, I rung her and I said, "Do you want to do a deal with us?" And she she was really excited.

She got on and and Channel 7 were furious and like and they were like and I said, "I want to advertise and sponsor Dancing with the Stars." Well, we were too small. We were very small at that point and didn't have a big marketing budget. They go, "We don't want to waste our biggest talent on on a on a brand that may not spend with us. Probably won't spend." What year was this?

This would have been 2007.

TV's on. And and so yeah, so we I I said I'm going to share my numbers with you. I got 70% growth of the Ricky Ponting campaign where we just advertised in the cricket with Ricky Ponting. I'm going to share my numbers every week with you cuz you're making you're not letting me advertise in Dancing with the Stars with your personality. You said you can advertise everywhere else but you can't have it in Dancing with Stars. I go I'm not going to be able to afford advertising with you unless you deliver the growth that I have got out of Ricky. And so I showed them the you know we got 15% 20% growth. It's not the 70%. And so they they they went to the BBC, they got sign off. We had Sonia in the ads during the program and then all of a sudden 70% growth. So real influencer targeting people that are interested in the message. Um and then you know we're now responsible for all those block people that do all those adverts and everyone else that's in a TV show that's now become famous for advertising something else. M

There is definitely an element of that, but the fact is we had the assets. So we had Nicole Kidman, we had Ellen DeGeneres, we had the Olympic rings on the Australian Olympic team. We were the choice of them. That took us years to qualify to be that. Um and so we had all of these international thought processes that counted in an international market. Now, if you asked a local person who the Nicole Kidman is, they wouldn't know. But the influencers knew. And so, the influencers tried our product. And when I go to the 70% retention, they'll try it and they go, "Wow, this is so much better than anything I've had in the market." The science supported that. So, this is this is the key about building a product that's linked to science in our nutrition space. And that had always been a fundamental of our business and a fundamental of how I am too. my father being a professor of surgery, my mother a medical scientist. I got lectured to from a very young age about the the wonders of diet and and the causes of disease if you if you don't appeal to a healthy diet. And so yeah, so we we had these assets that yes, people of Chinese national background that were living in Australia uh or tourists coming through or students studying here, they would see these assets they were familiar with and try our product as influencers or locals. And then you know the ultimate thing is the gift of health in China. And so these influencers are talking about how wonderful our brand were was and they were trying products that that Ellen DeGeneres or or Nicole or the Olympic rings that they com you know these assets they were comfortable with and and so it took off. We had 130,000 resellers of our brand into China. And so we were selling two times more than the biggest Chinese competitor, three times more than the biggest US competitor and five times more than any Australian brand. And so I went and hired a watch guy in um in Asia from that who'd been selling watches to Asia with Dior and and and Tissot and so forth. And we called it Project Gold. And he focused on on on Mandarin language, point of sale, and optimizing the channel. And that's how it grew so rapidly. We're ahead of the curve on that. And the reason why is cuz it was desperate. I had zero sales. I mean, sorry, zero profit. I was like, where are we going to get profitable sales from? And yes, in places like Boxhill, we were selling 10 times more product than what we were selling in in in in in um maybe the Hawthorn. Um so, um so, uh yeah, so we we we built built on that momentum and um and followed through and tailored a campaign that that you know really harnessed the the Project Gold opportunity in China.

100%. Like you you vision and intuition and and intention is is essential. And so, I'd always I' I'd walked people out of the room if they didn't say that we were going to be worth a billion dollars. And they said, "You're you're crazy. You're not even taking them on the journey." Um but you know in my gut I had always seen I mean I remember picking up the Swisse product which my parents had given me as a teenager to get through adolescence um the men's multivite and I looked at it with suspicion but I also had a connection with this Swisse brand and I was like oh that resonated and stuck with me and I do go back to my moments in life where you do have those moments of flow where you connect and if you go deeper with that I think there's a whole lot in that. I'm a I never used to believe believe in manifestation and now certain things have happened in my life that I'm like it's just it kind of had to happen

Yes. And I kind of believe that now that your life is pre-ordained and the turn of events that happen to that they can be manipulated but the outcome's already predetermined in some degree.

It's a higher force.

I did all of that. I I spent it recklessly on on some businesses that I thought would be, you know, exciting to be a part of and totally different industry that I knew not much about, maybe a little bit about, but you know, had a lot to learn and probably didn't take a a kind of controlling share either, managing share. So, restaurants, restaurants, um, education, I got a list, some tech. So, so did that and then also had this kind of change in kind of lifestyle where I wasn't working as intensely. And so you you go through this period of being in fear or flight mode where I was cooked and and so my body started to feel safe about where I was at. And when we feel safe, our past catches up with us. We we we start to process what we've been through. So um yeah, I I I um I would lose my train of thought in in presenting to a large group of people. My my my mechanisms for kind of computing and doing things weren't weren't operating like they'd operated a you know as a leader of a billion dollar business, multi-billion dollar business. I I I'd kind of go, what's going on here? And and you know, that led me to you overthinking and and and being in a situation where I thought I was having a heart attack.

It was the I I there was no plan to semi-retire, but it was probably just that that catching up, the safety of I've done this now. I can breathe. Yes. And then my body going, okay, well, this is now the baggage, the shit you got to deal with to get through. And and so, yes, I was in an ambulance thinking, I was having a heart attack and by the end of it, anxiety.

I think it was digging deeper into the tools that I'd already started working on as in in my journey at Swisse is into meditation um and and taking time for myself twice a day, taking time uh you know controlling the controllables like um you know making sure that I I don't overdo things um and and also nurture the the most important relationships in my life. sort of partnerships um around me, friends, family, wife um and and so so yeah, so that that was part of the journey back. But then also just working with my meditation coach and and exploring further beyond meditation purpose like you sort of speak of and and that connection to that that kind of bigger calling. Um, but also just understanding my makeup and my background and, you know, where I've come from, my family, my parents, what drives me. And some of that, it seems very sane to me, but it's insane to others when you explain what I've gone through. and and getting to coming to peace with that, like not having to prove things perhaps to to to family that that you know I didn't need to prove anymore, but I still wound up and doing whatever it was that got me to the stupendous result as of Swisse.

That is probably true. Like there's probably some hidden trauma there I'm not aware of, but explored all of that. Yeah. Yeah. Even though you've kind of surpassed them in terms of um financial success, you still want their approval. Yeah. Your your your rabid for it and your inner drive comes from that. Yeah. Correct. Launch me. Which one I can do? I can do. Well, it's not enough still. Yeah. You're not going to get a different reaction. It's going to be pretty similar to what you've always got. So, that's your insanity to break the cycle.

Yeah. I mean, for me that wasn't difficult for me. It was really difficult for me when I was at Swisse as the CEO and I was on four corners or or the 7:30 report. I' I'd been through the front page of every newspaper where I'm getting a hard time over evidence and or even trying to generate evidence and doing research. We got a difficult time over that with universities. So, uh, crazy stuff. Um so so I'd kind of been well drilled in the kind of media game and I'd learned that it's never personal. It's lobbying. Yeah. It's these kind of forces that are beyond beyond individuals. They're about an industry and and maintaining an industry as it is. So you know in restaurants uh we were the we we bought into a group of restaurants with with George Calombaris good friend of mine. He was an ambassador for us at Swisse um who I had deep respect for and and just you know such a gentleman.

Yeah. And he was the antithesis of kind of a a union movement to to make change um and and to ensure, you know, restaurant hospitality workers were were were part of a union group. So, it was a union campaign. Even though we'd done the right thing, we bought into the business. George only owned 10%. I'd increased his his shareholding to 30. He'd negotiated on our behalf. who they'd found out, his partners found out it was me, they would have charged a whole lot more than they would have charged George. And so I shared that that difference with George and he became a major shareholder alongside us. Um and and so we but we got in and we go the books aren't right. The payroll is not right. We we we saw that within 2 three weeks.

We purchased because we did no DD. We couldn't do DD. So So we've opened the books and gone, "Oh, hang on. This is this is a right mess."

Oh, because we wanted to get the fair price. Knowing the business partners, like if we'd done the DD, they would have changed the price point because you don't do a transaction until it's ended. So, it was either take the a fairer price point or take the hit up front and you know, a whole lot of things we would have done differently now, but uh for for for what I said, it's been one of the greatest learning experiences. So yeah, from who how I felt then was more how I felt for everyone that worked with us, George primarily first, but then our team, there was 500 people that ended up all losing their jobs as a result. Uneasy situation. And you know, you talking to to representatives of of the union that would say, "We don't care about the business because they're not members." So this was not it was it was not about George. It was about traction and and the media hype that it got. It was front page. I was on radio explaining our situation and how we'd paid everyone back and and um and we we we we'd apologized and we've done the right thing. Um and we continue to try to trade and uh it became near impossible as the fires happened because Master Chef's huge overseas as much as it is in Australia. The fires happened here in Australia just before COVID and so we lost 10% of our audience which was the international audience that would come because they thought Australia was burning which it pretty much was. And then we went into um and then we went into COVID and so it was just tap out. We'd lost so and that alongside the the negative media momentum that we we we'd had. Um yeah. So so it was incredibly painful to to be part of that for me personally. It was more of empathy and trying to understand. It wasn't pain for me. It was a great $20 million learning experience.

so the underpayments as well as overpayments and then also this is overpayments 100%. They kept that quiet. That didn't matter. Exactly. So you I've overpaid but you're still a piece of shit It it just showed that the the the actual system's incredibly broken. We're still seeing to this day, you know, for a casual worker to be paid 65 different ways for a restaurant. It's insanity. So, this is bureaucracy gone mad. And I'd say to the unions, you should provide an app that your members can just type in what their qualifications are and how much they should be getting per hour and then they can check their their pay and tell the employer the week they get their pay whether they got the right pay or not. Let's let's be proactive about this rather than reactive. But that seems a bit crazy. We're very good, very good at reactive. And now we see massive companies like Coles and Woolworths have hundreds of millions, billions of dollars worth of these bills that they need to pay. The government have got it wrong. The ABC part of the government, you know, a lot of government services don't pay their haven't paid their um casual staff, right? universities. This is this is BHP the biggest companies in the world cannot work it out um and haven't been you know they're starting to maybe I don't know but we were the start of this whole wave of change and unfortunately they chose to focus on hospitality the small guys first

and and so pretty unfair because as a small business was a small business um and and you know these big businesses can't even work it out was yeah but we reconcile it

Yeah. At 100,000. There. There you go. And it's now worth about a billion. Yeah, that's right. Fuck I know you can't think about that, but it's still I I'm very happy about that. I feel very comfortable about it. I think that um ultimately the the the Boost Juice team with their pedigree and understanding in that space, that's why it's worth that. And so this goes back to we have superpowers where we're we're a little bit better at some than others in in one industry. Yeah. Than others. And so you by practicing that superpower is this something that I've learned along that investment journey is that now that I'm a little older, you know, when you're younger perhaps that doesn't matter as so much because you're still working out which superpower that is but with a track record you start to go, oh these are things I do a little bit better than others. So um so yeah, that's been the readjustment of my investment focus. Our investment focus is to kind of focus on those areas where we we got a few more tricks than others and hence the guys with Yochi, they deserve their success. But also

Yeah. Well, maybe. I mean, Yochi was uh that was making over a million dollars still when we sold that business for $100,000. People didn't do enough work on administrative businesses administration. Um so so yeah and it wouldn't have looked good for me to take that business out of

It's it is it's very much a it can be a challenge and and I think the the the challenge was is we really needed to consolidate the core business which we struggled to do and then Yochi needed capital to expand whereas the the the I used to call it the aging armada. the aging armada, the existing restaurants where they're aging armada and they needed to spend to update them and and to get, you know, kind of repositioned them in the face of the PR fire. But no one could have really um forecast what we faced and how much, you know, it it did um hurt our business.

Um well that's the thing is you always if you're reinvesting you're you're investing knowing in venture high-risk venture that it it might not work out. So it was never a situation where I was putting my life's position. Yeah it was it was you know and many other things have more than paid that back. And the only challenge is when you are investing after you know a big outcome like we got the the things that don't go well don't go well in the first three years. So and you're going through this change in life and lifestyle am I doing the right thing and reinventing yourself you know at periods of time it's like am I going to lose this 250 odd mil that I've pulled because of the you know and but you know and things muddle away and then and it does take a generation to build a business like 10 years you hear some luck stories where it's five or seven years but overall it's 10 plus years and that's when you get the big flow through which we're starting we're in now in that 10 years and life's feeling pretty good but you and easily lose a quarter a million a quarter a billion dollars if you do some really terrible investments. It's definitely doable. 100%.

Six different legumes. So legumes are extraordinarily healthy.

cancer prevention

100%. This this this is so much science. If you put that together with a cancer cell, it'll it'll cause it mayhem. So, if you talk about cancer, um just for our conversation, uh Google just released that their AI has now developed a potential cure for some cancers. Just I just read on the news before

Well, I think that we've always got cancer in our systems at some point and our immune system is fighting it on and off offwards. anything we can do to enable our system to be in the strongest capacity can to kill that onset of cancer cells and there's more sprouts. So yeah, so he's like I'm I'm telling them to have sprouts and and they're so stressed out cuz they can't find sprouts in Melbourne. So um but then I'm living in Byron Bay with my ponytail here where I fit in there. Um, you look you look the part like look at the clothes. They literally fit in there. But here, you know, I'm kind of different, you know. Um, and and so, but there's sprouts everywhere there. So, I couldn't help dad with the Melbourne situation, but in in in um Byron, well, Brunswick Heads, when I say Brunswick Heads, um, here people think Brunswick East, so I'm careful of saying that in Melbourne. Um, but Brunswick Heads. And I'd get my my sprout delivery of three and a half kilos each week. Um, and and so yeah, we we go through that. Our family and and our office team, they all love it. It's the best replacement for muesli. And put a little bit of olive oil on the top or old.

Yeah. So, dad dad's a he's a a father of integrated medicine. He was the first to talk about diet in conventional medical circles in Australia, if not the world. um and and and it causing disease. He was laughed at back in the 70s. It took 20 years for it to be published. Yeah. And it's kind of laughable that we thought we we lived in that age. Also did research around meditation and its effect on on chronic disease and people coping with with major stress. And so, you know, his great passion has been creating integrative medicine or functional medicine as what we now know as well. And and us being able to empower ourselves to be as healthy as we possibly can be to deal with whatever chronic condition may come. And so yeah, he started the the first medical school that in in Australia that that focused on integrative medicine with Swinburne University. Um it was very challenging for for him to build that because back in those days as well. Yeah. Because of just the nature of our system is focus on fixit medicine. It's drug as

or or medical devices and that's where all of the money goes to u nutrition and lifestyle is is is this new thing that's been driven by us consumers. Yeah. who are demanding it now of their doctors to know more in this space and in Australia we still don't have it as a specialty it's not a function you can't do a functional medical integrative medicine course dad's course at Swinburne is no longer there um it's now national institute of integrative medicine so it had to be done in an independent body because of all of that those pressure points that happen because of lobbying and change um because you know government fund you know millions billions of dollars worth of of clinical trials each year um and so it's very competitive And so it's already competitive enough for the drug space and the medical device space for nutrition to come into that space. There's no want to start to make the pie a little bit less focused on on perhaps other things that could count. But my

That's right. Well, that's the system. It's set up like that because it's the those that are making our capitalist system rewards the organizations that are most profitable. Yeah. And so the most profitable organizations for a long time, tech changing that, have been drug companies and medical device companies. And you know, rightly so. Massive advances in human uh life. But our next stage, you know, that that's probably starting to top out. AI is starting to support it and might see another wave. But also knowing more about nutrition, what we're putting in our in our bodies, how we're feeling about life. It just makes so much intuitive sense. Like, let's not wait till things are broken. Let's be in as healthy a possible state as we can be. And if do think we do run into challenges, at least we're in a really healthy state to deal with the the the rigors of drug medicine that would have to write and and fix certain conditions. So if you're really healthy, you're going to go a whole lot better than an unhealthy patient.

Yeah. Well, it's inflammation. So if we can manage inflammation in our body, we manage all chronic disease. So 90 90 odd percent of chronic conditions or all causes of of disease is linked to stress. 99% of causes. And the stress could be external or internal. And then that leads to inflammation. And the inflammation is then what turns into a chronic disease.

Incredible. Incredible. But they want to give us pharmaceuticals, which I'm I'm all pro um modalities. But I think you need a balance of both. And that's that's the challenge with the system is doctors. uh still until recently we we did a a check you know that they over a 10-year course in a specialty program there's one term focused on diet and nutrition and I would have thought it'd be as equally as important as every other method or you could study a specialty like we suggest functional medicine or integrative medicine where you could go deeper so then a GP could refer someone that needs that support. We've got naturopaths, dieticians, but they're not nearly as well respected as a a doctor and a specialist and and so they're very useful as part of that process. But for doctors to really accept this modality, I think we need to see a specialty come to bear in this country.

Um I I threw a DNA test. Um I just come to understand a Mediterranean diet is best for me.

Uh, no. It was 3x4 genetics, but I've done the MyDNA one as well. That's good. Yeah, I'm I'm an investor in that. So, there you go. Nice little plug.

Interesting. Yeah, I've done that. You said you should take these supplements, eat this particular food, and it's pretty much on point.

Yes. Ventures. Yeah. I mean I Yeah. So, I've done incredibly well out of setting up a marketing agency for Chemist Warehouse, which we we sold back to them and um it was called Stratosphere. It's called Strat. So, yeah. So, we we did really well. We did that at Swisse as well, Noisy Beast, and that did incredibly well as well. It it got a valuation that was tied to the Swisse brand and and Stratosphere got a valuation that was tied to the Chemist Warehouse brand because it was so essential as part of their offering of marketing. Um so that that's been fantastic and you know we Swisse Swisse was the biggest customer or or biggest supplier at at um Chemist Warehouse. So we rode the wave together in growth. So incredibly thankful for the connection we have there. But in this day, I mean, I I I I did do a whole lot of bank fund stuff with um funds management stuff with my old business partner um Adam Gregory, who came from Goldman's and and so we invested in in bonds, crypto funds, and an impact fund, which I was particularly passionate about, which is now the largest in the country. Um but look, I pro I'm starting to move away from that as Adam's gone his own way. um and and um and really making sure that we focus on where you know we're a little bit better than others and that's in the health and wellness space.

So uh Wanderlust has been a wonderful journey with that and and the event business that that's connected to. Um and then we have a a um uh the beauty chef which is a a beauty um ingestible range of products um mainly focused on the gut. Um, and then we have healthy chocolate like a love chocolate which doesn't move your blood glucose

Yeah, I'm a significant shareholder that chocolate. I didn't know that was yours. Yeah. So that that that's only happened over the last 6 months, but that's an incredible business that's just growing at just just so exciting. So um so yeah, that that group is about 60 odd million in sales and um starting to make some good profit which is excellent. But yeah, it's been been quite a journey. So

All three of them. They're I own probably equal shares of majority share. We man manage and operate them, but Wanderlust has been kind of one that I I started up in a way. It was an events business and and it wasn't a supplements business and and so I decided to turn into a a supplement business and and so yeah, it does plant-based herbals, but it also does bio biohacking range as well. So um and then we put on events that allow community to connect um and is you know necessary part of of the holistic approach is is learning and um and you know even meditation is part of those events and and so we like to introduce people to modalities of health and democratize that connection make it really affordable and accessible for people to hear from various voices. Um and so yeah we've got a biohacking conference coming up in in Gold Coast. Um

Been talking about that. David Asprey and David Sinclair going as well.

There's a whole lot of luminaries. Yeah. So, it's a incredible list of of wellness superstars coming through the place. So,

Jeez, we got some budget. we we've got some budget, but you know, for for us, it's it's part of kind of people going deeper with our brands and understanding the connection, becoming brand evangelists after um learning about the best in nutrition that that also features in some of our products um and and you know, just just encouraging people to kind of invest in their health forward and and provide that opportunity to do that amongst uh like-minded people.

Well, meditation's probably number one because that that voice in our head is that that person you'd fire in your life. Like there no one speaks to you like our inner voice speaks like and it's relentless like please don't speak to me folk leave me alone. Give me a break and they won't. So um just I suppose investing in in you know like people brush their teeth every day or have a shower. investing in your mind is so so important and and it's been you know something I've done now for over 15 years and and many people have told me you can't meditate your way to profits and it's happened many times over um the other thing is um is yoga mobility as we get older I mean I my knees are terrible um so have have arthritis got to do stem cells

here yeah did in Australia

Yeah. Not great. Next level. It was It was a painful process, I must say. And I actually did a Hawthorn board meeting straight after the process.

Yeah. I could hardly walk. I got home and I fell on the ground cuz I was so cooked after that that um treatment. Yeah. So, that was brutal. Um so, yeah. So, um yoga, but mobility as we get older, just flexing and and keeping our mobility is so precious. Um, and it also is could is kind of there's a likeness to our ability to change mentally as well. And so that link back to a yoga class where you go through the highs and the lows in a yoga. You go this is fantastic but there points where it's boring as batshit and you're going when's this going to end? But that's life. And so it's a great practice of life and then you come to the end where shavasana and you're like oh I'm going to sit there and relax. Isn't that like the end of our day where you can go ah so you're practicing out this model of the day.

is just staying active and purpose driven activity. I I just love community work and and and the joy I get from from supporting people that are doing amazing things.

I'm I'm looking into that in Dubai. Yeah, already does. This is where the Australia system's great because it's it's it's very good and it provides a level of service but for when you if you've got the capacity to invest in your health which really is should be our biggest primary thing that we do you know other systems and enable that and um yeah yeah I've seen that gel that actually they put in your knees that reattaches the ligaments the stem cells to help regrow.

No, no. I'm I'm I'm probably going to fly to Dubai and do it, but I'm doing Costa Rica stem cells in January, man. I'm massively into this stuff. Some of it works, some of it doesn't. I do PRP um very regularly and that's been really great for me. So,

No, I don't know. Dr. Mayer at at um at Neokea um he's at National Institute of Integrated Medicine.

Oh, really? Oh, there you go, mate. Great chat. Thank you for that. And thank you for the the cancer prevention sprouts. I